[Dstar] D star rent costs

Tue Aug 5 08:36:12 CST 2008

Hi Mark

I am in the same situation as you.
I work for JRD Communications and now also own Western Communications vic
And yes, nobody understands the efforts we go to and expenses that are 
involved.
I Run the VK3RHF System here in Melbourne.
10 mtr, 6 mtr ,70 cm and 23 cm bands all cross linked with numerous voting 
receivers as well
currently 5 sites involved with links to all involved with one of them a 
SOLAR site.
I pour tons of hours and dollars into it myself with little assistance like 
your self.
Try to explain the costs and efforts involved and it all goes to deaf ears.
A whole radio club pays for one repeater and think they are sponsoring the 
world.
It's a great thing that radio clubs do get involved in repeaters to see how 
much in involved.
Not as simple as getting a $10.00 s/hand FM828 and two antenna's with 50 
feet of RG-58 is it..
The WIA costs for running all the repeaters they do is HUGE, and yet how 
many grizzle about
paying a small WIA membership fee.
Yes every time an antenna fails or Heliax cable run get chewed by cockatoos
an expensive rigger is required, as well as LDF 4-50 Heliax at the least 
and Ruggedised antenna.
No Commercial site can run these days without a $20 Million Dollar 
Liabillity Insurance either.

Well said  Welcome to the real world of radio as it is in 2008.

At 08:36 PM 4/08/2008, you wrote:
>Hi Will
>
>Welcome to the real world of radio as it is in 2008. Financial pressures
>regarding licencing of commercial frequencies which are way over anything
>you are charged for amateur licencing per frequency and bandwidth put
>enormous on costs to any decent repeater site let alone the govt/council
>charges for rates, electricity and the myriad of other hidden charges. Most
>ham radio clubs try to back onto these sites and in 90% of cases the
>commercial site owners out of the goodness of their hearts and the desire to
>see forward thinking and emerging new technologies prosper and also because
>most ham clubs are full of keen people will really go and try to assist in
>any way possible. There are of course other site owners who want every
>single buck they can get because the radio industry is under huge pressure
>from other comms technologies and long gone are the days when your radio
>site made great profits. Most radio sites now just break even or slightly
>better if it is run well.
>
>Your job if you accept it is to find one of the site owners that is one of
>the good guys and is appreciative of all of your efforts. But when you get
>right down to it, it is the commercial operator who is subsidizing a lot of
>the fixed costs. Long gone are the heydays of radio when it was all easy to
>get things done and sites for free. Having to have riggers on the site now
>because of OH and S issues and the chance of being sued is a big issue.
>VK3KRD's response is spot on about the whys and wherefores of the matter of
>forward thinking and generous commercial radio companies.
>
>I am a commercial radio company and also a ham radio dealer so I have a foot
>in both camps and if anyone tells you that you make lots of dollars out of
>selling ham radio they are not telling you the real story. Yes we do make ok
>money out of the commercial radios mostly but that's getting harder and
>harder now as well. I am putting up a Dstar repeater up at a site I use at
>the Sunshine coast and all of the costs are born by yours truly and as you
>now know how much it all is to do it at a commercial site with all the
>correct filtering used so you don't get killed by all the other commercial
>services it starts to run out at a lot of bucks. I am extremely lucky that
>the owner of the site I use is a good guy and doesn't charge me much as well
>as I do things for him at the same time on his site which saves him bucks as
>well. There are a few people up this neck of the woods who have made some
>pretty crappy comments about "commercial operators" putting up and taking
>over Dstar to sell all the Dstar radios to make all this money and they are
>going to make a fortune. Well I can tell you that the costs to buy all the
>gear....no its not donated or funded by poker machine grants... its all paid
>for by yours truly in one way or another it would take the sale of about 500
>plus dstar radios to even come anywhere close just to break even with the
>equipment cost spend but now we get the running costs on a per year basis
>like the ADSL connection, electricity, license fees, maintenance, lightning
>strikes, insurance etc and any other incidentals on a yearly basis it
>becomes a pretty big task. Does it sound like a prosperous business case to
>you?
>
>All I can offer you Will is that as a club you have many guys at your
>disposal who are keen and you may need to look at some sort of fund raising
>on a semi permanent basis also you need to find a sympathetic site owner, I
>am not sure of the situation over there...maybe someone who owns a house up
>at Kalamunda up on the range there..well I think that's how you spell it but
>that would be a great site anywhere up there for Perth. Long gone are the
>days of 2 antennas when sharing sites because of the radio saturation and
>things like trunking and multiax you need a radio repeater no matter what
>mode it is in with proper hi-spec duplexers and isolator and good feed lines
>and proper antennas that don't become harmonic generators. That's the price
>of playing radio now.
>
>By the way I am hoping VK4RDS will be on air in about 4 weeks all things
>going well
>
>
>Just my 2 cents worth
>
>
>Regards
>
>Mark Kyle
>
>Kyle Communications Pty Ltd
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dstar-bounces at lists.wia.org.au [mailto:dstar-bounces at lists.wia.org.au]
>On Behalf Of Will
>Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 9:44 AM
>To: dstar at lists.wia.org.au
>Subject: [Dstar] D star rent costs
>
>Hello all,
>
>In VK6 we are working on the D-star repeater site
>and costs are of prime concern for our local
>repeater club (WARG) who have taken on the
>project and many of the costs involved.
>
>Rent for the good site that has been found
>for the D-star repeater, along with an analogue
>repeater, is of concern.
>
>What has happened in the rest of Australia in
>terms of rent costs...?
>
>Any info would be appreciated as we need to
>know where our club sits in terms of costs.
>
>D-star is an added cost that is above the
>normal running costs of the club which has
>budgeted for decades based on analogue
>repeaters etc.
>
>Will
>VK6UU
>
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>
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Steve Reining VK3JSR
VK3RHF System Owner Operator
29.640/29.540
53.625/52.625
438.750/433.750  enc 88.5Hz
1273.400/1293.400
4 Way Repeater System
http://www.vk3rhf.net [VK3RHF WEB PAGE]
PO Box 1025
Huntingdale, Victoria
Australia 3166
Work Ph 03 9543 3811
Mobile 0428 538858
steve at jrd.com.au
www.jrd.com.au  [Work Web Page]  
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